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Good morning, good evening, good night, good afternoon, whatever time you're listening
in, wherever you're listening from.
Shout out to my Spotify listenership, Apple and Google podcasts, and YouTube if you're
watching in.
Thanks for giving me a reason to get dressed.
You could have been anywhere in the world, but you're here.
Be present and recognize that it's now, right now.
Whether your right now is working, flying, running, driving, be thankful we're alive,
baby.
Failure can be frightening.
However, as Winston Churchill reminds us, success is all about going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm.
This is I Will Not Lose podcast, where we set out to prove everything is learned from failure, and we must persevere and recognize it as one step closer to success.
I'm your host, Tony Ortiz. Let's jump right in.
We got to talk about that. I'm fucked up.
One, two, one, two. All right, we're live.
Rolling, rolling.
What's up? What's up, man?
What's going on, Tony?
what's going on it's been a minute man hell yeah it's been a while i don't like either of you
yeah we got phase back in the building phase one legendary producer goat producer and goat mc
yeah yeah but we still had the green screen last time he was here that was a while ago that was
like six seven months ago maybe more probably i don't know but you've been busy since then
been very busy yeah because you had just dropped comp slim 3 or no it was just about i don't even
think you had dropped comp slim 3 no we did that no because i dropped that in um uh what's the six
month may april or june june i can count you guys are still you guys are working on the album for
like two years right yeah i thought i thought it was one until i put up that behind the scenes
posting that thing said two years ago i said oh where you were working on flowers right oh yeah
yeah yeah i'm surprised it took that long i mean it would have been a lot quicker if we weren't
adulting you know having day jobs and right everything else that we got to do i feel the
same way but i say for listen for how rarely we got to be able to get together well we did maybe
not even a session a month i would say no probably not probably not and for for how
seldom we were able to link up i think we got the album done in a decent time yeah because when when
you shared that that post the other day about um two years ago is when we did that song um
like right after then i moved into my house um because we moved in on halloween two years ago
okay so i was in the transition of moving we were already like four or five songs yeah so there was
a there was a big gap in where like i was just down and i think only one or two songs didn't
make the album it was a couple couple yes oh for real i figured there was like 20 tracks it started
with or something no album's like a cool half an hour yeah so there was gonna be more cuts but i
saved a couple there was a couple songs that um i think the both of us felt that the beats weren't
there but we liked we liked the song but it just wasn't the best match and and i just i re
remade a couple of them you gotta you i think you need to redo i got it the remix the beat because
that was fire but it was just you know yeah that that was the song that i already had that you just
jumped on though so that that's not like you know we were just trying shit out so if i work it into
book two then or yeah that's already in the process on his end and then once he uh he digs the
foundation then i'll come in and start putting the stilts up you know i mean that's dope already
already in the making already there's already uh it's already con it's a concept that i'm both
wanting to both concepts so it's already laid out and everything yeah i wanted to get into that some
of the concepts kind of what i took from it ah man i can't even tell you how many times i listened
to this album front to back on shuffle from good morning back it's a it's a great body of work
appreciate that um you were taking it you're back from a break like you kind of opened with that as
far as like solo because i just dropped the album two years ago yeah like two and a half years ago
with nyla shout out nine yeah we dropped a little it was more like an ep it was only six tracks
the 1980s 1936 1936 yep yep and then uh so yeah i mean i don't know how many people were plugged
into the album like i didn't go crazy pushing it hard like that i mean we we recorded we had we
were sitting on that album for over five years oh man and it just wasn't and then she finally
moved to la and i was like that i'm putting this shit out like i've been sitting on it for way too
long me and tug's next one's gonna be 1945
oh lord what a year i see you uh in your post you talk about playing music from older generations
or older time not even playing new stuff so is that where a lot of your inspiration comes from
nah i i if anything that inspires my musicianship like what i play but as far as like the hip-hop
stuff nah that's a i don't think so no fair enough but no i was listening to intro it kind
of opens up you kind of open up saying i i'm back i took too long um sorry for all my negligence
yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah it was it's just a conversation you know how do i want to start
this album i was literally that was the first song we did it was the first song we did yeah
almost in order is that is how i recorded the album almost oh there you go so it was just a
natural progression how do i want to and the last song i did my verse last it took me like two years
to write that a bar you killed it you killed it i was like yo he got all this time he might
outshine me a little bit so you know he deserves it he put a lot of work he he can get on that he
got got off on that but um yeah it was just closed up the album too it was like the whole concept
like you had that line in there about fool's gold you know it's all who knows who and uh it's all
fool's gold and that really hit me like even the title track of fool's errand where you go into
at least the way i grasped it it's kind of like you know you're you're sharpening your skills
trying to be the best the goal is to be put on or to make it whatever the success is you know and
yeah i i took it once uh the the next generation was like yo who cares if you could rap good if
You could just say, yeah, yeah, all over the track and people like it.
And that was like the wave.
It kind of still is.
You know what I mean?
And I was just, I was taken back by that.
Like, oh shit, people are actually agreeing with this?
What have I been doing for the last decade?
Sharpening my steel.
What have I been doing?
It's all just been for naught.
It's been for nothing.
So that's kind of where the album came from.
He was very jaded, very bitter, very upset.
You know what I mean?
And then by the end of the recording, I was like, I can't end it like this, which is also
why the last name of the song is Good Morning, but morning spelled as in a death.
You're mourning something.
I want to leave that shit behind.
And that's why there had to be a book two, which will be the opposite of this one, which
is filled with gratitude and positivity.
I don't know if you did this on purpose with that song or not, but my first album was called
Good Morning like that.
Same way?
Yeah.
Oh.
No.
but it's more beautiful
that it's like that
it's fucking amazing
so it's the last song
but it's my first album
I'm on it
yeah
and I'm talking about
my short journey
in eight bars
synchronicity
I think that's what they call it
synchronicity right
it's crazy
that shit was crazy
but you said
when you opened the verse
you said Tug introduced you to Chain
so you guys
this is the first time
you guys connected on an album
you had that
on a full album
that one sample in there
where you were like
Tug we never connected
on the album
now we connected
on the album
plenty of songs
a lot of studio time with this dude
that's where I heard of you was in the
little 90's style
text I'm trying to think what was the
track where you were in the record store the coloring
was like really yellow
that was the video
he say she say
he say she say
I think I might have recorded that one in New York
in Queens no I think you
recorded that with me because I
had the spot in Whitehall
no no no I recorded that in Queens
shout out Ed Rock he was the DJ
yeah that cut up on the okay that cut up on the drum i got the beat from you yeah yeah because
i had the spot in white hall we had a song like i was like rapping um uh uh not what do you call it
recreationally i was rapping recreationally with like my friends and stuff like that but i was
still doing beats for like tug and i was trying to start up a studio and um we had that beat we
had a song on that beat and um tug really liked it he just did another song on it and i was like
go for it because you know we ain't really putting shit out we're just like rapping for fun and you
shot the video yeah yeah maybe i saw you in the director credits then yeah yeah and i shot the
video too that was one of the first videos i ever shot say word as well that's history that was like
2009 i don't remember so what made you decide to connect on this one then you come to him with the
No, no, no, no, it was 100% phased.
I wasn't even thinking about it.
I'm like, all right, if I'm going to do another album,
I figured I'm going to do some impossible shit.
Not impossible, I'm going to play guitar and just rhyme the whole album.
Like, nobody's doing that anymore.
If what I focused on my whole life doesn't mean anything,
you know what I mean, then I'm going to switch lanes
and let me get on this joint and show y'all.
It's crazy when you see it live.
If you've ever seen somebody do that live, it's pretty crazy.
but he hit me up like yo uh we're doing an album fuck all right yeah he's gonna take care of
everything he did all he did the majority of the work on i made all the beats he did the album cover
kind of he did he mixed master i did an album cover and then it came down to last minute we
were like what are we doing with the album cover yeah you showed me something completely different
yeah no no no he he played uh when he came over the one he showed you which one i honestly i don't
even remember though the first one was like text it was like a black and white gucci style i do
remember that no i gotta i got partial to this one because i see it on my spotify like it it
paints the the color for the album like right i think i think you've made the right choice
yeah we got this album cover while the last three songs were uploading right that like that's how
last minute it was three seconds left on the clock yeah we got that yeah he had an album cover in
mind that he liked it and i i really wasn't partial to it and then when he sent it to me i was like
dude this is not like the file wasn't big enough like if i stretched it it was gonna be pixelated
and i was like we can't do that we got to do something and he didn't like what i well i mean
he i like he did not like it but i didn't feel like it i said it looks more like a mixtape than
i was gonna say if i had any critique on what i remember of it it felt more like it would go with
devin haley's brand does that make sense maybe like sometimes it takes me a while to to really
figure out um an artist's um aesthetic so it's gonna take over over time trying different things
until what fits them but you nailed it because this reminds me kind of of the styling of the
the language arts volume two when you're with the surgeon and stuff like that i've been had that
forte for a lot of my work
there's a lot of book related stuff
just the artwork
I think that style
of like that the dark colors
the shading the way that it is
I mean it looks cohesive
it looks dope but I wanted
to get into that intro
with the instrumental break
and then the guitar solo
then you bring the piano back in
I was ex-invase he's like
sounds like you need to be walking with spurs
into a saloon or some shit for that uh but then you have the sample about don't quit it's like
is it worth doing any good yeah i didn't write the exact sample down but no no for sure that
that kind of set the tone for the album exactly that's why i had to go in there i've been sitting
on that sample as well for for years and i was like this is exactly how i feel every time i'm
starting an album and i was gonna put it in my last album but it just didn't fit it didn't fit
in the the bacon and eggs anywhere i tried to i literally tried to fit it in there but it didn't
work um yeah and also on that the background beat to where that sample is is a reflip of a sample
that we the very first song we did together so the other synchronicity is on the intro i reflipped
the sample uh that that we did our first song together and then on the outro he used my first
album's name inadvertently that's crazy so that's wild it's that binary and he didn't even realize
the sample until like yeah he was like yo is this this is the slow joint oh shit that's crazy
that's wild so i got into um i that's the next thing i wanted to talk about was kind of you
guys's history how you guys connected um just a story you told a little bit about connecting
with chain and then creating that legacy yeah well over there how we first connected was actually
through myspace myspace because i was um i was in in college at full sail and myspace was getting
big and i only stood a year down there in orlando so you know i'm paying attention to what's going
on in the hometown and stuff and artists and then i found i came across tug i was like oh your music's
dope i like it you know i'm coming back home at some point in time so let's link when i get back
into town and i think you sent me some tracks probably because you know i gotta hit hit first
yeah past the vibe check i was like all right yeah we'll let you go when you get back it was
it was dope i was like all right and that first track we did yeah from there and then and then
yeah i was like all right you're gonna need some i think i linked you up with with cheney because
he had the studio yeah because i had the i just the place in whitehall under my dad's shop that
i was trying to build up and he was like oh i know i know this guy who has you know more stuff he's
been doing in a long time maybe link up with him he'll he'll help you out i just connected the dots
that's all that's how you got to do it that vibe check is important you know what i mean it sounds
so it sounds so cohesive the different like uh the one sample where you it's not a sample you
straight up left in the original raw audio where you're like okay i'm definitely gonna redo that
and the song just like cuts out and goes to the next track or whatever even yeah uneven yeah that's
what it was an uneven uh that was real that wasn't acting that's how and we he was just like no we're
keeping it like that all right whatever you say producer man and you started off with one of those
like um because that's done a lot in hip-hop where it's like you'll start off saying something
they say leave that in or whatever yeah you did that but without saying leave it in i was like
all right that's perfect spit the verse cut out from there um i just feel like doing stuff like
that like brings it brings the listener into the world the process and yeah into the world of the
album like you feel included like you're in the room with them well you do a good job of that on
all your projects because it's like how many people put out albums you don't even know who
the producer is right they got a couple beats from over here they did this they made track number four
and they put the compilation together you know there's nothing wrong with that but you could
really feel that process so that's cool yeah it keeps everything cohesive like so many people's
projects just sound like thrown thrown together and you get different qualities and different
like a whole different sound from like song to song on a lot of people's especially local albums
and it's like what this doesn't feel cohesive so well i don't know it's all the it's all the
fool's errand right at least as far as book one is concerned you're talking specifically about
rap and the whole i think it's specifically about rap and the the i don't want to say the newer form
rap but it's kind of evolved into like tiktok and viral stuff like it's i mean even with podcasting
people are going to see clips from this and they're not going to go and watch the whole episode
six seconds cool that's what they said yeah that's cool it happened that's also why i every song is
like not even three minutes on this project i didn't even notice that that makes sense though
yeah it's easy to listen to yeah yeah the the time uh i don't know what the word is time the
time horizons for songs anymore attention span yeah the the span has shortened over the past
i don't know hey we used to do three 16s three yeah mandatory every single song that was like
that was the format that was the recipe yeah i said you wanted them old songs we did back in the
day the your bitch chose me john and you i think you had three verses on that and i listened to
that and i was like dude you got another verse to be over dude yeah i'll tell you what it makes
my job a lot easier shit i don't even gotta write 16 i think that there might i think there might be
a 12 bar verse on this new album i might just said fuck it that's it that's it that's all i need
fuck all that i'm here's eight bars there you go take that with you yeah if something's not
happening with the with the beat or the track's not moving yeah if it's not shifting up if it's
not proceeding in a way that's interesting to the listener they're like what is going on like i just
listened to um i don't know if you guys listened to uh the the new west side gun i haven't heard
yet and it's like um it's good like the beats are good but then it's like six minute songs where
the beat doesn't change at all and there's like five dudes on it and you're just like
i mean that could work if it's done right because wu-tang did that shit all the time
as long as you get a new voice that's the thing that changes up is is the rapper type shit but
no i hear what you're saying i hear what you're saying it just gets um listening intense intensive
gonna have to check it out maybe that's just something that maybe is meant to throw on
i don't know like music has a some some of it feels better in hoodie season some of it feels
better in the car sometimes it's like all right when i'm with my boys i just want to throw on
something yeah when you're out when you're out at the club you don't want to listen to my shit
see that shit that makes a female magic corner pocket coming on in the club what is this
yeah no everything does have its purpose um but i'm not judging it that way i'm just judging
from a general perspective of listening you know so if you're not making something that that's
as i not aesthetically entertaining but something to keep people involved throughout it has
multiple dimensions it has multiple levels it's not just a drum kick bass line and for three
minutes yeah but i wanted to get into some lyrics it's funny you have a ton of great features
awesome features on this album i think they were well selected it hit the flow very well
um but you had uh down the rabbit hole deeper than the catacombs this is a one-man journey son
you'll be mad alone that was this album is full with bars like that where it's like
i don't know if you're mad at yourself puzzles you're kind of like questioning
there's a lot of like questioning going on yeah i mean that's the whole mentality of a
fool's errand is realizing you've been on a fool's errand and then the contemplation that
goes on thereafter that's what this basically this whole fucking album not the whole album but
majority of the album for sure for sure for sure well done it's a very one-sided yeah perspective
but it works out because like i feel the same way too as a producer and being into rap the whole
time like we go through our uh at all lives like chasing this dream and then you like you find out
that um most of the rappers that are on have like an uncle who's like the ceo and shit and you're
nepotism yeah i didn't realize there was nepotism in hip-hop you find out all these things and
you're like oh okay so it was never really it was probably not really possible ever but again that's
why book two has to be made because i can't end say it might be my last time i can't end on that
note yeah so i had it's gonna end with happiness gratitude book two it's felt like that was the
transformation and body rot you had like uh oh at the end you mean no well you you had said i think
you said i think i'm coming off kind of depressing i think that was in that yeah yeah yeah you know
what i mean and it was kind of like switching it was like okay i'm gonna i get it you're tired of
hearing me complain i i get it yeah yeah but i'm gonna do this i'm gonna do this and so that's a
crazy metaphor body right that ain't even till i die like you die your body's still there it's
And at the very end of that song, with his production, he puts in a glimmer of hope right at the end.
If you listen to the song, there's a nice little glimmer of hope right at the very end, production-wise.
Yeah, there's a little bit of light at the end of the tunnel.
Yeah, a little bit, yeah.
I have to check that out.
That changed a bit, too.
You played that for me.
You played an earlier version of Body Rot.
I think so, during, yeah, or after our first interview.
Yeah, that was when you showed me the cover.
so that's crazy I can't imagine how many different versions everything went through and it's still
probably to the point where you listen to it now and you're like oh man I wanted to do this or
switch this or are you completely satisfied um I'm never fully completely satisfied but that's
what keeps an artist going yeah I mean that's what keeps me all these years later still going
back to the studio but I'm I'm very satisfied I'm completely satisfied with with it as a whole
as as a project you know what i mean i think it came out great like that i think it's
maybe as far as like concept it's probably my most complete album ever as far as concept i agree
that's what i wanted to do for a time too like mature because we've we've been we've been um
friends of musical friends for a long time and and he's put out projects where i'm like
i wish i was involved and i just wasn't um and um i was like he he needs he needs a project with
one producer he's that he's that type of artist and i feel like i could do that for him so before
before our time is up we need we need to do it well we got one more on deck buddy there you go
i thought that um this is like the hit boy naz naz shit no you think about i mean naz dropped
an album with kanye that's the thing it doesn't always work you can't just say let me take the
best producer the best lyricist and now it's going to be crazy like so yeah this didn't happen
overnight this took years and years to get to this point for me and him working together
you know we i shit it it took me years just to be able to give up control over certain things
musically you know what i mean there's certain things like nah i don't know you got to keep
this in and me you did all your mixing for a while too right i did everything for a while
and i had no choice you know yeah i have that problem too that's why i do so much so many things
but you know um work working with different artists over over the course of time like you
just learn to like try to push where you can where you feel things should be and then you know
your artists also have their perspective yeah there's psychology that goes into being able to
deal with people especially artists yeah yeah the worst and i know because i'm an artist too so like
i know like when somebody like critiques what i've done that i really love and they're like
oh maybe do it red and i'm like no that'll fuck everything up so i understand it as an insult i
try not to push too much and we try to like um come to an agreement yeah yeah so yeah it gets
it gets um if it's third quarter we're down 15 maybe i need to sit the bench and let him
yeah that's kind of that's kind of yeah that's kind of what happened towards towards the end
we're like we're never gonna stop like doing different renditions of things like i need to
cut myself off put put a date on it like we need to have it done by then yeah and and it literally
like you said it came down to to the last second side of shot clock and then friday the 13th yeah
so you picked that as the date and then got everything done for it by then yeah he told me
i need it what'd you say tuesdays and fridays or something he told me you need to pick one of these
days yeah so i just went down i was like oh yeah fridays for for like spotify and stuff you get
you have like a better chance of like landing on playlists or something so we just picked whatever
the next friday was and um put it for that that works man some of my other favorite lyrics uh
school of hard knocks but now it's like i'm back from college gotta ease up this was in uh flowers
where this is a this is a really important track for the album okay because you're talking about
So essentially from what I took it, like relaxing, enjoying life, not making it so much about being top five alive.
You know what I mean?
Like there was a lot of, like you said, rhyming is my silver lining, but also spending time with the family, spending time with the daughter, my boys when I go out.
The song was more like, it is kind of like a breather from the album, but it was more like me highlighting the fact that I know I'm allowed to deal with in my personal life.
I could be fucking stupid sometimes.
I could be, I might black out out the bar and you're gonna have to drag me out that bitch.
Like I might, I'm not easy to deal with.
I mean, I think I am, but I'm being an extremist on the, on the topic and just given, you know,
given the people in my life, they flowers.
I, it's an appreciation song for my shortcomings and the people that deal with me.
So that's awesome.
It's awesome.
Yeah.
I took it as a, I took it as like a pressure, even like in the chorus that's a, you know,
take the time to stop and smell your flowers.
I mean, I literally, I was listening to that.
I gave it another playthrough as I was taking my notes.
Before then, I was just kind of listening and formulating.
But this time when I hit it, it's like, dude, I'm appreciative of a lot of shit.
Like, this is crazy.
Yeah.
This is...
And how often do we take our time out to show that appreciation, to show that gratitude?
Probably not as much as we should.
So I dedicated a song to it.
There you go.
Now it's in there forever.
We got another Tug and King Mag track.
Okay.
you guys are no stranger to working with each other working with each other so that was cool
you guys were you guys in the studio or do you send verses um no that one we sent verses i got
on the track for his project i don't know what he's gonna use it on i i went out to see him
you know but this one yeah this one no no this one i was there for his verse in his studio
and then i had to do my i did mine separately but uh yeah it was mandatory you know we've been we've
been getting on each other's projects for for years now since back when you had pen and paper
that was yeah that like nobody writes nobody writes writes their verses anymore nobody has
like a fucking notepad and shout out king magnetic all of my any somewhat big features or or songs
that i had with with people that have names all been through king magnetic all of them so shout
out you my guy uh trifecta with joel ortiz comes to mind for instance yeah yeah yeah i bet you if
we threw that verse if you gave me just the first part of it i could probably spit that whole verse
uh i throw that on every now and then nice i remember how it ends with uh shows over lower
the lights good anchor i never had a chance to work with mag either so it's like we've been with
me and mag have oh that was the first time he ever got on one of your beats yeah yeah
so so that was cool too so because i know i know mag makes beats too so he doesn't typically just
hop on other people's shit yeah i'm glad we can make that happen there was a one line and i wanted
to go back to body rap for a second but you had uh kind of ended uh considered to be a shoo-in
but life had other plans i'm still in the boulevard a heart full of regret pockets full of
hard yeah like it's viagra do you regret yeah right in your world it is face oh shit um do you
have regrets for i mean the fool contemplates the errand do you have regrets for the stuff that you
like spending all the time i mean i know of course i mean of course i could be in a whole
different place in life if i did different things when i was a teenager but i promise you you
wouldn't have a song like body rock you wouldn't have an album like this so you know it's give and
take it's give and take because if i would have stayed off the block and went to college you know
i'm saying trust me my i it my song everything would be different but yeah it's hard to say man
it's hard to say because it helped build my character too you know that's why he would have
been sitting next to the guy who he made the album for yeah you never know probably like this guy
that's why it's hard to it's hard to regret shit man yeah it's hard to regret stuff yeah
the title track you really let it all out on the fool's errand that was an interesting placement
to not have it like right early in the beginning you know um i mean just the name of the album you
can kind of get the concept but it's how that concept applies to you personally and how it did
where you know you're thankful for what music gave to you for the character like just even
therapy it seems like a release you had said said that in a couple tracks where it's like you know
um get on the mic and just shoot the shit that was a i can't remember which track that's from but
you've said a lot in your music that this is something that kind of keeps you sane
there no no that's true it's true you know everybody has a thing what they do and at this
point i mean it might sound weird like i'm not i don't do this to be famous for money i don't do
this for pats on the back no more my main reason is self-therapy type type shit i still do it for
passing the back i need passing the back he needs to pass and then when too many people start doing
it i'm like ah get away from me i need people to not like me again let's now we need some
controversy but i also hope that that uh that comes through during the music and that might
reach people more than say other stuff you know what i mean like i hope people can also appreciate
that when they hear the album like yo this is real this is sincere you know what i mean i believe
what he's saying i feel this type shit so well i don't know you guys know the numbers but i don't
know how much of it is like brand new listeners versus like i mean i can't imagine somebody
coming into a fool's errand and then going back like i'd be almost jealous to have the whole back
catalog to be able to dig through and and kind of see where that growth comes from because there
was a lot of people not a lot of people but i did see people say like where's the where's the bars
like where's the oh like metaphors and stuff yeah just the the lyricism like i can't think of a
track for an example yeah i don't know it's kind of um one thing i did with this album i didn't
get beats from him and then go home and write to them and perfect them you know i mean that's
what i did for every album i'm gonna ponder on this and that's also like what comes from
you can hear that in the buchowski song where the the sample comes on and he's talking about
i'm not trying to fiddle with my i don't care about the old i didn't try to be acrobat
i wasn't trying to be flashy and lyrical miracle spiritual bullshit i went in the fucking studio
and every single song he was making the beat and i just right right there whatever comes to mind i
didn't have time to revise anything i didn't have time to fix anything i just went in there and just
said what was on my heart and my mind at the time and that's the song and if you're and that's the
song and if you're coming from your heart and your mind your heart and your mind doesn't think
lyrical miracle spiritual bullshit you just come out you just start saying shit that's that's that's
why my verse took so long yeah because you were doing all that fancy shit i was doing that and
he had the song done you know for a long time before i was like i need to get on that but
there was that gap in between his verses and i knew what i wanted to do with it which was i wanted
to rhyme off of his last line and also come back in to his first line of the second verse so that's
what kind of made me take so long because i needed to fit it in there in the right way and i didn't
know if i wanted to tell the story that i told or if i just wanted to like just just be nice
so you know what once that yeah once once the album was done i was like no i have to tell the
story i have to go back to my original plan which was to tell my yeah story in eight bars like you
said uh doing it for 10 years for people to be not moving the same right yeah you summed up the
whole fool's errand in a in a single verse at the end that was dope and that is him on the vocals
at the very end yeah yeah no no i mean like the singing vocals at the very end of good morning
you're singing at the end yeah it cuts out for a second and then it comes back with like a almost
like a kid cuddy type instrumentation yeah the guitar yeah the guitar that's tug playing a guitar
and i did like little humming on it oh does it have auto-tune on it oh yeah for sure okay i do
remember that part now yeah i do remember okay and the guitar solo that you think is a guitar
solo on the intro is also me on the keys playing no it's my voice yeah oh shit i didn't even know
that yeah what yeah how does that happen you just play around with stuff pause that's wild
that's wild oh man uh i have that sample in uneven i mean that pretty much runs through the whole
album we could play some music we could just get into um some of the other stuff i don't know if
there was anything what's going to connect with my listeners is the idea especially book two where
you know it's about your success learn from failure so or reframing failure that's a big
concept on the show like yeah right reframing success reframing failure that's good because
i wanted i actually did want to bring that up too because i get this a lot i don't know if you do
is when um um other people try to comment on your so so-called music career and then they go oh if
you're so nice why aren't you rich and famous yet and stuff like that and it's like i mean maybe at
one point we were attempting to go for that but it comes to a point where you become content in
what you have achieved and you're like do i you look at the people who are rich and famous for
music and then you look at how their lives have gone and you're like it doesn't seem like a doesn't
seem like a great life and my life's pretty good so you know i'm happy with what i've done yeah i
don't really get the people saying if you're so nice why don't you make it i get the why why
haven't you make it that makes no sense and i'm like it's so frustrating when somebody asks me
that like i don't know you told me well why don't you do we'll fucking be my manager then how about
that yeah i'm taking applications for managers what's good there you go right yeah there's way
too many rappers not enough managers and and that that has been a problem in the in the local scene
a long time for a long time is that everybody wants to be the man but they don't want to get
behind someone and help them in ways that they need and that's what i've always tried to do
which is why i produce and i engineer and i've shot tug shot videos i shot videos and um shit
i stopped rapping picked up a guitar yeah i was a guitar player for a singer for years
yeah yeah for for not a girl who sang on flowers i was like a guitar player
that's super dope and do shows that's super dope i might did you ever post any of that or yeah
I posted some stuff
and some clips
but you know
I'm not everyday
yeah that's hard
on social media
it's too much to deal with
I just
but every now and then
you know what I mean
Tug's just an old school
underground rapper
I'm just like
yo get off my lawn
son
get off my lawn
what you need to do
is get on TikTok
with that guitar
and uh
nah
yeah nah
I do have a TikTok
and I posted like
one or two things
but again
it's so many to
to juggle with
like
yeah
I would love to
I would love
and I
you're right
that's what you gotta do but i would love to get to the point where i could just have somebody do
that shit for me like go ahead here you have control i'm pretty sure my music page probably
still has a couple administ people who are allowed to do shit on my page that i just completely
fucking forgot about could be you need a it's like a it's like a paywall though like you can
have you could post and you could put stuff out but if you really want stuff to go viral like
it's money yeah and i don't know tiktok's algorithm like that but with everything else
that i've worked with it's better it's better i'm not on tiktok but the algorithm is better than
instagram like i had that problem too like with with everything i have the same problem like
i start doing these things and then the uh it's just diminishing returns and engagement and then
you're like what am i doing this still for and so it happened with videos it happened with
rapping it happened with um uh uh uh instagram and photography photography and it's just like
when when you first started when tiktok or not tiktok like instagram first started
people start following you for they like your pictures or whatever you're posting
and then eventually your content starts to get better but i didn't get like a new follower for
like two years like even though the content is progressing in a better way like yeah it has
nothing to do with the content right i've had something go viral on instagram that had like
100 views on youtube like it's how do i have 33 000 over here for the same piece of content didn't
do nothing different descriptions the same yeah and i hate that shit like why do we why can't we
just focus on what matters it's fucking music right like i just want to get drunk and go fishing
and make music for people that like my music that's all i want to do it was the same thing
with videos like when when we were doing started doing videos in like 2009 2010 and everybody
wanted to do or at least attempt to do like these elaborate videos and have uh you know multiple
locations and a storyline and all this type of stuff and video girls no and then it's like you
do all this stuff and then youtube's cutting your organic views down by 90 so you know back when
when um when music videos were really a pretty popular thing we would easily get at least a
thousand views if not between one thousand and five to ten yeah dependent depending yeah like
with like no paying just organically people watching a video yeah so once like the i don't
know 2017 or something like 16 17 it they literally just like turned the spigot off
and i was telling everyone like dude like videos ain't it no more you need to just click go live
on your phone fuck doing shows what are you doing shows for like you you waste your whole day
like preparing and trying to get people to come and then 10 people come if that and
you're upset you could just hit go live and at least double we'll watch you'll at least get 20
views yeah instead of 10 so just perform on live you could do that and with with the videos
i just started doing one location video we just set the camera up we perform the song i don't
gotta edit shit that's the video yeah just find a nice location that looks decent do your song
there's your video walking around with the camera inside the house spitting into the camera yeah
now those videos are tight though it just gives you some sort of visual it gives you something
else that was like uh shit was that 2009 when did you do the video for like nobody
oh shit um i might have been no i think it might have been a little earlier maybe
2008 i mean you could we could check it real quick but uh yeah that was i did that i shot
that one myself and that was so old i think it was before uh dear solage dropped yeah because
you started fucking with champ and yeah champ yeah that was back i think he started he started
probably around 2006-7 a little bit before that because he shot my video with jinx uh with the
when truth attacks video in 2006 i'm pretty sure i was the only motherfucker out here with a music
video at the time yeah like the first um i could be wrong but uh yeah and then he used to take me
on jobs because i i was on uh i ended up having to move up the block for him and uh i couldn't
really long story short i wasn't able to leave the house um so he i would go and he would show
me i was editing stuff and and he put me on he'd take me to jobs with him after i got off for that
situation take me to jobs with him he made me the cameraman he taught me how to chop it up edit he
He just took me under his wing back in the day.
And then that's how it started from there.
Yeah, that Like Nobody video was shot with a JVC little handheld thing like this big.
Yeah.
Just walking around, walking around the town with that thing.
That was like, I think that's when 1080 first was available to the public for like public consumption.
Was that in 1080?
720 HD was a thing.
Yeah, I thought the video had to be in 720.
We were like, oh, it's in HD.
That's all we cared about.
yeah sd everything was sd before that yeah yeah that's wild but man all those different travels
that you take on like creating just being a creator in general you know what i mean to
i had to stop last week and just look at like even what i created with the show i'm like
damn i'm a hell of a hobbyist i get i get uh i get sucked into stuff yeah you didn't
investing in this for nothing yeah waiting on some uh some equipment to come in but i don't
know if we do play any music you want to play good morning whatever you want to play we aren't
we on your show right now you're gonna have to use one of your uh phones though because mine's
recording oh you can use my crack screen if you want word what's your favorite track of the album
uh bounces like i like body rot a lot but i can't play body rat all the time like when i'm in the
shower in the morning and stuff but for the most part i like it as a whole i listen to it when i'm
designing and i throw stuff in i love the beat on intro corner pockets one of my craziest but it's
like uh that's a fun that's a fun song that's what i would say it's like a fun song like it's not
like you you don't put it in there to uh shout out these skills these skills yeah definitely
he surprised me on that i didn't look i don't read the track list before i do i just throw an
album and go on from there so i was like oh shit and then he matched your flow where you guys kind
of did the stop and go i don't know what to call it but all the og bethamites no no d skills yeah
Now that you now that you say it, I think it makes more sense that all the tracks are under three minutes because I can't think of like I know the chorus for flowers and I know the chorus for wise is the man that knows he knows nothing.
Yeah, that's an interesting quote that goes, you know, my listeners can definitely relate with that as well, too, because people think success is like this place that you get to.
and you get there, and you're like, shit, I'm not there.
What the fuck?
Fun fact, that wasn't even the original beat for that song.
No?
I rapped over the whole totally different beat.
There's a few songs on there that he went and said, fuck this beat,
and made it better, and produced the whole song underneath my lyrics
that I already recorded to something different.
That's one of them.
That's wild.
That's wild.
Do you guys have any behind the scenes?
Do you have any besides the, I saw you post the flowers,
making but not besides um what he posted and then l money did the the one little teaser for us um
i didn't see that that was about it yeah it's on my it's on my ig it's when uh it was right before
i started recording the bukowski track that was and that was supposed to be honestly bukowski
actually was just going to be called interlude i just recorded it as an interlude one verse until
So he put, he started, I think around that time in the middle of the album, he started
understanding truly where I was going with the album.
And he found that passage from Charles Bukowski, the American poet.
And I didn't even know about Bukowski.
I heard of the name, but he put it on.
I said, yo, that shit is perfect.
That's great.
Like this is, this is perfect.
And then I looked up Charles Bukowski and I started learning.
I went down that rabbit hole and I was like, okay, he's like stoicism.
What are they called?
Stoicism.
Stoicism.
Yeah.
and i was like this is this is the falls in line with the album and i said fuck it i'm just gonna
call this track bukowski now instead of interlude which was boring shit but yeah right yeah that's
wild no you're putting me on i didn't know about bukowski yeah there's a lot of shit like like
next album we should definitely do more um behind the scenes footage and documenting you have to um
it'll be good because this is gonna be a happy album so there'll be a lot more smiles than ice
grills no but so for a long time we had like the bone the bones of the album and and tugs like what
are we gonna do with this song what are we gonna do with that song like they like it they're just
like unfinished i'm like you just just wait just give me some time save it i yeah because like to
find to find like the bukowski thing like i have to go through and listen to a bunch of different
things until that one thing strikes you was that the actual poet's voice or was that somebody just
no yeah that was him from an interview oh shit okay see i don't need i'm learning stuff about
that i'm still yeah right that's wild yeah so well we're talking about it you want to throw
so we could keep the listeners engaged with what we got going on so you could talk over it but uh
for the most part i think our mics are going to be muted for this part that's fine you're one two
check check especially for your life
I'll take it from here, come follow my lead
I do it all for the love, not for power and greed
Somebody tell me why the good never make it
It's a science project, stuck in a trap
Most never escape it, my first felony at 17
What the fuck is going on, life is but a dream
Through the smiles and frowns, around and around we go
Till we six feet under and down we go
Of course by hellfire and set me free
Ashes to ashes and let me be
If it wasn't for Nia, shit, I might have bust my flame.
But her love was so big, it obstructs my aim.
More riches and peace for all kids in the street.
We all want the penthouse, but we're living beneath.
Pick it for your mom, dude.
We'll check the check.
Those beats are more for the yeah rappers that just say yeah on the track.
Those complicated beats cover up their lack of wordplay.
So it fits better with that.
Shout out to the yeah rappers.
Yeah, yeah, shout out to them.
Keep doing what you're doing.
I ain't a hater.
Shout out to them.
Put me on a feature.
That's good.
Tempo plays a big part in that, too.
It's gone.
It's done.
If you can't write the next line, well, you're dead.
The past doesn't matter.
I think that's another aspect that's a little bit different from this album to your previous ones.
is especially because of of the the time gap in when albums got done is tempos have gone double
time from then and beats within the 89 to 98 aren't really used because they sound old school
now to to most fans coming into it now so my tempo range that i produce in mostly is like
in the 80s to like low 90s so we have a we have a really hard tug on slightly slower beats slower
beats that makes a lot of sense still not in the range of double time because then we're talking
about like then we have to get to like 80 like like on corner pocket that's more of a double
time yeah and um you sound you'd almost sound different there's a couple there was one track i
i can't remember which one it was but you sounded different and i don't know if it was uh maybe it
was a feature but it was like i don't know if he did it on purpose the first half of his verse
it didn't sound like tug and then it slowly started on this project yeah um yeah what song
was that i'm curious did you when you did good morning did you come back afterwards after he
spit no no he had it that might be it because i just went in the he he uh syllable wise was way
more rapid fire than i was on that track i was laid back yeah and then when he came on as it was
very rapid syllable fire so to go from that back to my he's back it might have sounded a little off
but yeah that might have been the scap the yeah and i usually utilized the um the jay-z reference
on there when i did the um full sail introduced me to kane because jay-z had the thing that he
was getting introduced to cocaine and my my old um i'm not partner music collaborator that i went
to full sail with his name is kane so i said full sail introduced me to kane came back tug
introduce me to chain yeah so that's like a whole jay-z reference in there too yeah that was that
was super dope i i was like i threw my headphones on tight when i when you first came on on that
track the the first listen to and then that's probably good morning's probably one of my
favorite tracks on the but that could change depending on my mood that's like right now
my grandma line this might be one of my favorite lines on that i like that line too
uh where you embrace the love i know the i don't know the exact line but you had said she has a
cutty whip from alabama riding through the back streets on my way to see my grandma she got a
couple she got a plate of rice and beans a couple fried bananas not much but as much love as i can
handle yeah that's beautiful yeah yeah yeah i like that one but we'll throw on good morning
and then maybe start
landing the plane
for sure.
Yeah.
That's all right.
I'll mix it.
I'll make it work.
It was amazing.
People will like that.
Like, you can drop
the music lower
in and out.
I'd like to hear a commentary.
If they want to hear the song,
they can still play it.
I got a pocket full of stuff.
I'm full of dreams.
My thing in between.
Blocks filled with crime.
I've been on the scene.
I know what's happening.
I always wanted to use
provocateur in a song.
That's a great word.
Ill word choice, man.
I got a hundred and a hammer
Cutty whip from Alabama
Riding through the back streets
On the way to see my grandma
She got a plate of rice and beans
A couple fried bananas
Not much, but as much love as I can handle
Far from perfect, but I'm worth it
Guarantee your head bang with every single purchase
With pays on the track
A blackout of game
I call a circus
I've called a service since 06
Full sail, introduce me to Kane
I came home, tug, introduce me to chain
Jumped in the game, producing
I have you proving my name
I spent a decade for people not to be moving the same
Who's to blame, but who knows?
This shit is about the who knows who
And you know they give you kudos
It's been full gold, jump through the whoop holes
The gold will put you in a trap
I'm old now, but now I'm new to the fact
Most of the time I ain't even in the mood to rap
All these weirdo rappers don't ruin that
I need some new friends, my old ones gave up
Still doing the grind, ain't got room with mine
Grab and take a barn whip for breakfast
Then I casually claim my rights to the whole room
Aim to and chase after
You'll never be a different pedigree
Let it be a lever to feel the energy
So I'm chuckin' deuces
At least by now, now you know what truth is
This gave me like a
Kit-Kat vibe
I don't even know what that means
I gotta listen to Kit-Kat
He's famously known for his humming
Ah, okay
But this, my wife loves this part
She was like, this part needs to be its own song
well it is the bridge to the next album okay why it's good morning morning as best i'm saying
goodbye to this mentality yeah yeah yeah i'm gonna go into put that one to bed and now we're gonna
a new day it's also why there's no uh at least i think that's why you didn't put it in
oh no i don't think i played it there's no uh resolution so if you know about music theory
i stop right before the last note when there should be a resolution because it keeps it
open for the next album there you go that's that's what queen did and with um um bohemian
rhapsody okay everybody thinks the song ends with um um what's the end of the on end of the chorus
nothing for tomorrow i can't even think of the song right now
yeah let's put it up
yeah this is some real music
shit I love it but don't give me copyright
flag though no no no you can
cut this out that it ends with
we are the champions of the world
but it doesn't they just say
we are the champions of the world
I got you
super dope psychology
yeah
go producer go to MC
finally connected on the album
getting another one
Imagine the person that finds book two, like they just stumble across Tug McGraw book two.
They're like, oh shit, there's a book one.
They're like, oh shit, he's been doing this shit for 15, 20 fucking years.
Yeah, that's how it was with the language arts, the volume.
I went up to what, volume four, I think.
Volume four was the bacon and eggs joint.
Yeah, I think you did.
Oh, was bacon and eggs volume four?
Language arts volume four, bacon and eggs.
Makes sense, yeah.
that one had
Vulcan
Vulcan Death Grip
shout out
Booze Brothers
yeah
I like that album
yeah I was too
I tell people
they was like
why Bacon and Eggs
I said cause man
you don't wanna
turn up and shake your ass
as soon as you wake up
you need some
wake up music
you need some
Bacon and Eggs
when you get up
you know
roll to the store
smoke
do an L ride
go to the store
do what you gotta do
that's when you play this album
I do wake up
and shake my ass though
oh Jesus
there you go
there you go
Now, I got my different morning wake-up music, but that'll set the tone for my whole day.
Exactly.
It makes sense.
I've been actually rocking, you know who is great morning wake-up music?
And this is not a diss anyway, but Quaisa.
I've been throwing on Quaisa, a little gospel rap.
Give me like, it's not quite as slow as like a ballad type gospel song.
Me and Quaisa are working on an album too.
oh see i was gonna leave that unresolved so that we could lead into the next episode now i just
said that's a place of the artist but uh that's dope you guys are welcome to come back on the
show anytime uh sure whether you got something promoted something to promote or not um just talk
music shoot the shit i'll be back for book two yeah definitely come on for book two it's cool
to give the listeners a little more behind it because nobody appreciates that an album takes
two years and especially when this guy drops them like you might have to slow down just because it
yeah he's been on a tear this whole year was it four albums you dropped yeah five technically five
because i put out um you remember to ours we used to work with jimmy breaks okay the whole and and
when i say project you produced the whole entire album of those five um there was a little chain
on the jimmy right yeah to me me and jimmy or jimmy breaks album is me and rick okay okay so
yeah technically yes nice that's wild yeah he's doing putting a lot of work this album is is
basically half his album it's basically our album that's why i hit you up to do the thing and i was
like yo you gotta come with me bro this is just as much your album as it is mine so yeah yeah
for sure
and we plugged it too
so that's cool
we keep everything going
but
I don't know
if you have anything
any closing thoughts
um
stream the
book one
Fools Aaron
everywhere you stream
your music
we already
about to be back
in the lab for book two
and uh
I hope you enjoy it
Tony I appreciate you
yeah man
thank you
you said you're on Instagram
right
yeah
Tug McGraw
T-U-G-M-C-R-A-W
what else can
you got any other
social or anything you need to shout out just hit up my ig i don't worry i i reached my friend
already for facebook so i can't really add people unless i start deleting people i found
them on pornhub actually yeah that's there you go channel check out the only fans you know it's
a fool's errand it's a fool's errand at least he's transparent it ain't the it ain't the music
it's all there it's all there but yeah man um yeah spread the word if you like the album
send your friend the link man appreciate it oh yeah all right cool shout out your social phase
oh where do you want people to check you out um what's my instagram now it's just a phase just a
phase it's just a phase on everything just search it search phase one um pretty easy to find tug is
very hard to find on the internet i'm not so you can find me through him yeah there you go if you
if you just search tug tug mcraw the baseball and then put phase yeah the baseball guy comes up
So put Tuck McGraw phase one and it'll come up.
Yeah, man.
I was tight when I lost my iPod.
I had a language arts volume two.
I actually bought it on.
And back then when you lost iTunes, like when you didn't have the account, you lost all
the music that you purchased.
I don't even think that's on line anymore.
Volume two.
It's not.
You got to have like a hard, you got to have a physical copy.
And volume one was never online.
Volume one.
that i think no i discovered you in two so i don't know if i ever even heard one yeah one i think we
did i did with a double edge i think it was 2006 i think when that dropped i think so i think i
think you've dropped that before we met yeah that was old old album my first one the appetizer
yep crazy old i don't even i don't even sound like the same person anymore 2005
I've seen some thangs since then.
Yeah, man.
For sure, for sure.
Well, all right, man.
Thank you for listening.
Yes, sir.
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